Is China an alternative to capitalism? Economist Clara Mattei, author of The Capital Order and Escape from Capitalism, professor of economics at The University of Tulsa, and a co-founder of FREE (Forum for Real Economic Emancipation), joins Roughly Chinese to discuss austerity, wage labor, market dependence, and the political control of capital. From the United States to China, we ask why capitalist societies treat the economy as inevitable—and whether China shows that another logic of development is possible.